'Even among Geniuses, Luck Plays a Role in Winning a Nobel Prize'

Denis Bodrov studies particle physics and works at one of the four electron–positron colliders in the world. In this interview with the HSE Young Scientists project, he talks about his efforts to go beyond the Standard Model, discusses tau leptons, and shares his affection for Moscow.

How I Started in Science

As a child, I loved reading physics books. Once I realised that our understanding of nature is limited, I wanted to become a scientist—to explore the structure of the universe and push the boundaries of human knowledge. At school—I attended a gymnasium in Obninsk—I did quite well in physics, taught by my favourite teacher, Alexander Sukharev. He was an engaging lecturer who demonstrated experiments and always had everything prepared perfectly.

One day, our gymnasium sent us to Belarus to attend an olympiad school organised by Moscow. It brought together children with a talent for physics from all over the country. There I was told that MIPT—the Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology—was the best place to study physics, so I decided to enrol there instead of following my original plan to apply to the Faculty of Physics at MSU. In grades 10 and 11, I won awards at the All-Russian School Olympiad, which later allowed me to be admitted to university without entrance exams.

While I was still in school, the Higgs boson was discovered at the Large Hadron Collider (LHC), and I felt a strong desire to devote my life to it. At MIPT, I therefore chose to study in the Department of Elementary Particle Physics—a field that is both among the most fundamental in physics and at the forefront of scientific research. At that time—and still today—I wanted to explore what was as unknown as possible. That was how I chose my major back in ninth grade and have never changed it since.

How I Came to HSE University

In 2020, the International Laboratory of Elementary Particle Physics was established at HSE University. Its core research team consists of scientists from the A.I. Alikhanov Institute of Theoretical and Experimental Physics. My academic supervisor, Professor Pavel Pakhlov, is a Leading Research Fellow at the laboratory. I was admitted to work there on the Belle and Belle II experiments while simultaneously completing my master’s at MIPT.

When I enrolled in a doctoral programme, it was at HSE University. The HSE Faculty of Physics was founded by scientists from MIPT, and nearly all the professors in my doctoral programme had some teaching affiliation with MIPT. I enrolled in an advanced doctoral programme and received a generous scholarship, along with the added benefit of being accommodated in the newly renovated Doctoral Students Residence on Lyublinskaya.

Where I Work

I now work remotely for HSE University, while spending most of my time at Soochow University in China. I participate in the Belle II experiment, which is carried out by an international collaboration of over a thousand scientists from more than twenty countries. The experiment is based near the city of Tsukuba, in Ibaraki Prefecture, Japan.

The experiment is conducted at the SuperKEKB electron–positron accelerator, where electrons and positrons collide and annihilate, producing new particles. These particles then decay, and we study the resulting decays.

Belle II is the detector situated on the circular accelerator and the successor to the Belle detector, which was developed in the 1990s using technologies anticipated for the 2000s. When the original experiment reached its limits in the late 2000s, development of a new detector began, anticipating technologies available today. Belle II is designed for long-term operation and is expected to collect fifty times more data than its predecessor.

The Focus of My Research

Heavy electrons—tau leptons. They are produced in the accelerator. Over its ten years of operation, the previous experiment collected nearly a billion tau-lepton pairs, including both particles and antiparticles.

What I Take Pride In

There is a theory that describes our world quite accurately: the so-called Standard Model (SM). Its development spanned decades—from the 1930s, when particles were first discovered, to the 1980s, when the theory was finalised. Many scientists, both theorists and experimentalists, contributed to its creation.

Despite its strengths, the Standard Model does not account for everything we observe, and we cannot directly study what it leaves unexplained. For example, it addresses symmetry breaking but falls short in explaining the observed asymmetry of our universe. There are also more specific phenomena where the model fails to perform very well.

I developed a theoretical method and then applied it to study one of the parameters of the Standard Model. Recently, this work was recognised with a gold medal from the Russian Academy of Sciences.

The tau lepton decays into muons, and the description of this decay involves several parameters, which the Standard Model predicts precisely. Any deviation from these predictions would signal the discovery of new physics. However, the parameters describing the polarisation of the muon had never been measured. In principle, it was possible, but technically very challenging. We have now developed a method that allows us to measure this parameter within the existing experiment.

So far, our results have not revealed new information, because we used data from the previous experiment, which is insufficient. However, we were able to demonstrate that the method works, identify potential pitfalls, and create a roadmap for the future experiment—outlining what needs to be implemented to achieve high accuracy. It was a substantial amount of work, spanning about five years. I devoted the final two years of my doctoral programme exclusively to this research. We published several papers, which now form the basis of my PhD dissertation.

My Dream

At school, I dreamed of winning a Nobel Prize. But I soon realised how difficult that is: even among geniuses, luck plays a role, and I am not even a genius. Now, my dream is to do something meaningful for science, so that my contribution may be remembered. As for my goals, I have just defended my PhD dissertation; next, I aim to defend a Doctor of Sciences dissertation and, if I am fortunate, become a member of the Academy of Sciences.

If I Hadn't Become a Scientist

I would have become a programmer, because I always enjoyed it when in school. In fact, programming is still a significant part of my work. All our software is written in C++, and we perform data analysis in C++ or Python. I find all of it fascinating. Last year, I was developing a program for our software, focusing primarily on writing code.

Who I Would Like to Meet

Isaac Newton, so I could observe his work and try to understand how he managed to create an entirely new science—physics. And Aristotle, a true giant of scientific thought.

I would also like to experience the Soviet Union of the 1940s and 1950s, to witness the enthusiasm of scientists and see how the first research teams were formed. Nine Days in One Year, a Soviet film about physicists, is one of my favourites. I would love to feel that atmosphere and work alongside those people.

A Typical Day for Me

The great thing about being a scientist is the flexible schedule. I always try to wake up without an alarm clock, since the day is wasted if I don’t get enough sleep. After breakfast, I settle down to work. If I’m in the mood, I can work until nightfall—but if I feel tired or out of ideas, I can take a break.

My main job is data analysis, so I spend most of my time at the computer. I can work from home, but I prefer working in the laboratory, where the atmosphere is more conducive. It’s also more enjoyable to be around friends—I can play table tennis during breaks or just chat. Sometimes, I take walks in the evenings. Nowadays, I spend most of my free time with my girlfriend. She is Chinese, and we are at the same university.

About China

I live outside Shanghai, in a place with a rather unique culture—surprisingly similar to Russian culture in terms of human relationships. The language is very complex and difficult for me to master, especially since I mostly speak English there.

I really like Chinese architecture. The cities are beautiful and full of greenery. However, the weather where I live is terrible. In summer, it reaches 35–40 °C with nearly 100% humidity, while in winter, temperatures hover around zero with frequent rain—and there is no central heating. On the other hand, autumn and spring are beautiful. A lot of the food is very spicy, and some dishes I don’t even understand. I enjoy restaurants where they provide the ingredients and I can cook the soup or roast the meat myself.

Whether I Have Experienced Burnout

No, because I’ve found a way to manage it. If I feel fatigue building and lose all motivation, I take a week off—walking, traveling, relaxing—anything but work. Then I spend another week gradually returning to work in a relaxed mode. That’s enough to restore my energy. If I had forced myself to keep working, my results would have been worse than after taking these two weeks off.

My Interests Besides Science

I collect miniature models of Soviet cars, planes, and tanks, as well as commemorative coins and coins from the countries I have visited. I also enjoy playing video games, billiards, mahjong, cards, and chess. I have a passion for traveling. Scientific conferences—and even more so, internships—provide this opportunity. I have completed internships in France, Japan, and China, giving me the chance to see many sights.

Three years ago, I got a car, and now I enjoy traveling by car. I have already toured almost all of Belarus. Last year, we travelled to the Caucasus, including Kavminvody and Grozny, and visited Voronezh and Tambov along the way. I also travelled to Kalmykia—since a friend of mine in China is originally from there, I was curious to see how Buddhists live in the European part of Russia. They have a huge Buddhist temple, almost like those in China. I have also visited Vladimir and Suzdal. There is still more to explore; I once dreamed of traveling all over Russia by car, but it would take an entire year to do so.

What I Have Been Reading and Watching Lately

Demons by Dostoevsky—someone recommended it, and I enjoyed it. I love Dostoevsky’s writing style; it’s easy to read. As for the content and ideas, his books are best read in a good mood. If you’re already feeling low, they might make you feel even worse.

I am currently reading the Bible. I’m a Christian, but I haven’t read it in its entirety yet, so I want to fill in the gaps. It’s genuinely fascinating—such an ancient book. At the same time, I am reading research on how its accounts correspond to the actual events of that period, since I also love history.

I recently showed Star Wars to my girlfriend—she hadn’t seen it before—and in my opinion, it’s the best fantasy film ever. While in China, I watched the film Hao Dong Xi (Her Story). In local cinemas, Western films are often subtitled in Chinese rather than dubbed, while Chinese films are shown with English subtitles.

Advice for Aspiring Scientists

Choose a topic that genuinely interests you, one that you want to pursue. Sometimes, your academic supervisor might assign tasks that don’t excite you. You may want to work on something else but lack the time, which can be frustrating. If you don’t like an assignment, it’s better to decline and request a different one, so you can focus on what truly interests you—then time will fly by. Also, if you are in a relationship, it’s important to find balance: girls don’t appreciate it when you think about work during a date.

My Favourite Place in Moscow

Moscow is the best city in the world. I especially love the view of the Kremlin, particularly from the observation deck in Zaryadye and from Bolshoi Kamenny Bridge. Zaryadye also offers a magnificent view of the Kotelnicheskaya Embankment and the skyscraper.

In China, metro systems are built at about the same pace as in Moscow, and every major city has a metro. The city where I live, adjacent to Shanghai, has a population of 13 million. Until about seven years ago, there was no metro, and now it resembles the Moscow metro in the 1990s.

When I lived in Moscow, I regularly walked or cycled around the entire city centre. You can experience many historical eras in just one walk. Here, there’s a house from the late 19th century; there, an example of Art Nouveau architecture; here, a building from the early years of the Soviet state; and over there, a manor from the 17th century. Near HSE University’s building behind Kursky Railway Station on Staraya Basmannaya Street stands the Travel Palace of Vasily III. Although the Brezhnev-era buildings looming like candles over Pokrovka feel somewhat out of place, it’s still worthwhile to preserve them for historical memory. Moscow’s parks are magnificent—I loved cycling in Bitsevsky Park when I lived in Zyuzino. In short, for me, Moscow is an ideal city to live in.

Tokyo comes second after Moscow in this regard, with Beijing in third place. Shanghai resembles Moscow, just a more southern version. St Petersburg is also quite nice. I think that if Peter the Great had been as successful in the Azov campaign as he was against the Swedes, St Petersburg would not have been built on swamps but in a much more comfortable location.

My Favourite Place in Obninsk

Belkino Park, where we have our dacha; the Church of Boris and Gleb; and the ensemble that includes the city museum, the House of Culture, the House of Scientists, and a sprawling oak tree in the field nearby. If Morozovskaya Dacha had been fully restored, it would also be one of my favourite places. Today, it can be visited through a museum tour, but the interior is in poor condition, which is a shame—especially given the building’s long history. During the Great Patriotic War, it housed the headquarters of the Western Front. With proper restoration, it could become an outstanding museum.

The interview was prepared by Polina Surnina